00:00:00.03 nextlevelguypodcast not sure about first before we start 00:00:01.34 Tom Jenkins Oh, good. I mean, how long but do we usually go on for? I'm in no rush, just to know. 00:00:04.70 nextlevelguypodcast um that was the actual question i should have asked is how long have you got because normally it's about an hour just chatting well thank you so much for coming on you do have an ah amazingly titled book but for people who maybe don't recognize you could you just give a quick introduction and i'm quite excited to see how you introduce yourself 00:00:11.64 Tom Jenkins Yeah, about hour's fine. Yeah, yeah, all good. 00:00:29.62 Tom Jenkins Yeah, sure thing. My name's Tom Jenkins, recently released book, as you say, called The Drunk Gambler with Erectile Dysfunction, Searching for Something More. So I don't think there's another book titled like that, but it's sort of a journey through my life of... 00:00:50.74 Tom Jenkins of like how I grew up. I grew up in a good background, a good family and just made a lot of bad decisions in my teenage teenage years and early 20s, drinking, drugs, gambling, 00:01:05.98 Tom Jenkins ah sexual problems as well that I'm sure we'll be touching on and then the slow journey to sort of turn it all around and now based out in Colombia. 00:01:17.66 Tom Jenkins Been living here nine years, married to a a Colombian girl for the last five or six years. We met out here. Long story on how I ended up here. I'm sure we'll come on to that. But yeah, that's that's that's sort of the basics about me. 00:01:34.84 nextlevelguypodcast Because when you read your story, it's remarkable how you've turned out because when you start reading it, you're thinking, oh, here he goes. And then you go to Colombia to actually get away from the drink and the drugs and you settle down and you're building this amazing kind of retreat. You're looking to help other people, etc. But... 00:01:54.46 nextlevelguypodcast You did have a lot of problems when you were younger. And I think a lot of us are struggling just now with our own, you know, we finding ourselves. What were you like as a young man, like coming out school, et cetera? What started you on the slippery slope, do you think 00:02:09.66 Tom Jenkins Yeah, I mean, this is a funny one because a lot of people are reading the book now, like didn't really get to the extent of everything that was going on in my life. So i was for the most part just a kind, timid, shy kid, but who had an extreme lack of self-confidence, an extreme lack of self-worth, and an extreme lack of self-control when under the substances. So for me, predominantly it was alcohol. 00:02:39.70 Tom Jenkins um I wasn't an alcoholic. I was more a British style binge drinker. What that means is I could be functional Monday to Friday, wouldn't drink if I stayed in, stayed in my tiny comfort zone. 00:02:54.29 Tom Jenkins I'd be okay and I wouldn't be drinking. But if I went out, or if I went one inch outside my comfort zone and it was tiny, you know, I can't pinpoint exactly when or why or at what point, you know, my confidence and myself will have really begun to struggle. All I know is, During my teenage years and as I began to drink, it's just sort of the snowball effect now. 00:03:19.73 Tom Jenkins I'd use drink to cover it over. I'd do a lot of very stupid things, you know, stealing. I'm i'm always the guy, you know, at the party when you're a kid, like sort of in the corner throwing up. 00:03:32.30 Tom Jenkins I've woken up on street corners. 00:03:33.88 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:03:34.38 Tom Jenkins I've stolen from hostels and all of this stuff. you know, You know, it seems weird to some people because on the other side of that, most of the time i was just a kind, shy, timid kid. But yeah, those bad decisions I made just continually fed the spiral downwards. You know, the more I drank, the worse the confidence would be. So I'd gamble to escape and I'd lose the money there. But when then when you finish doing that, I'd feel worse still. 00:04:07.10 Tom Jenkins And it was just a long journey down until, you know, one big event. um That got me to the point where i just thought, I can't ah can't continue on this path. Thank 00:04:19.38 nextlevelguypodcast Because it's quite remarkable, isn't it? It's like that we are almost shaped by society to be these, you know, like this is what's expected of you. And if you go outside of the norm, you're almost kind of ridiculed and humiliated for it. And I mean, I can remember when I started the podcast, people like lambasted me the whole time about it and made fun of it. And now since I've managed to push myself on, 00:04:45.78 nextlevelguypodcast you know, it's kind of been accepted now, but I know that feeling when you want a drink to sort of hide from stuff or feel socially confident, what were you telling yourself at that time? Were were you aware of this or were you just kind of going into autopilot to hide from those feelings? 00:05:02.23 Tom Jenkins I was 100% aware. I mean, I think you push it, obviously, you you push it down and you try and hide it and you wake up in the morning and, you know, with your mates, you all laugh about the stupid things you've done. And, do you know, don't get me wrong, sometimes we're funny, we have good times as well. But a lot of that laughter was just just covering over what we've done that... 00:05:24.06 Tom Jenkins From the very first time I got drunk, I think I was 14, 13 or 14. I knew I didn't like this. And I knew when I woke up in the morning and I didn't feel great. I knew I didn't want, this isn't truly what I wanted. But the troubles... 00:05:41.02 Tom Jenkins unless you get to the root cause of the problem, well, it was kind of the the remedy to cover over that that lack of lack of self-confidence. And, you know, it was just easier at the time to continue with that. And, you know, sort of the British culture, i think things have changed a little now. 00:05:58.23 Tom Jenkins You know, younger people are turning away from more drink. Unfortunately, I think they're going to technology, you know, TikTok and Instagram and just staring at screens. I don't know what what one's actually better or worse. 00:06:12.82 Tom Jenkins But, you know, in the day, our culture, for me at least, was very much like that. You know, you finish work on a Friday, I was functional. And what do you do? You just go straight to the pub. And, you know, for me, it would end up, you know, one of the stories I tell in my books, I was gambling as well. And i went with a mate to Cheltenham Horse Racing. 00:06:34.06 Tom Jenkins We're meant to be staying with a friend of his. I didn't know where it was. I didn't know the person. He was in charge. He ended up in a strip club. I ended up in the stairwell of the University of Gloucester's halls of residence. I've never been to this university. I don't know where it is. I don't know how I got there. Just a complete blackout. 00:06:54.36 Tom Jenkins All I know I've urinated in the corner. That's sort of gripped onto my jeans. I've lost my phone, wallet and keys. And I've just woken up. on the floor with somebody kicking me to, you know, not kicking me to hurt me, but just kicking me to say, get up and get out. 00:07:12.50 Tom Jenkins What are you doing here? 00:07:12.50 nextlevelguypodcast Mm-hmm. 00:07:13.94 Tom Jenkins um So, you know, that that's one of the stories just to give a bit more detailed context. And, you know, after that, you just feel truly awful. But when you're in that spiral and you don't have, I guess, the tools or, 00:07:29.11 Tom Jenkins you haven't made that I haven't made that decision that now's the time to change when just so many different events and stories continued like that. Thank 00:07:39.42 nextlevelguypodcast And do you think that's something that a lot of men are now struggling with, it that we use it more to hide from it? It's that question that, you know, we've all had that mate that goes a bit crazy at parties or we've had nights out where we've been blazing and really struggled to remember what happened. 00:07:52.89 Tom Jenkins you. 00:07:55.90 nextlevelguypodcast But are we now at the point where a lot of people find their own path, but it's usually shaped by parents or their qualifications or just any job they can find? 00:08:07.84 nextlevelguypodcast And were you searching for something a bit more? Because the book is called Searching for Something More. Did you have an idea at that point of what was important to you or were you just hoping to find it? 00:08:13.88 Tom Jenkins Yeah. 00:08:19.71 Tom Jenkins No, I knew. mean, I always knew I wanted more and something different. And, you know, as I say, i come from a good background. You know, i can't complain. I'm not a victim story. You know, I just, I just made made some bad choices and went down some wrong routes that I had to get to the bottom of. But I knew, like my whole family sort of has a finance background. I knew that wasn't for me. 00:08:44.18 Tom Jenkins I knew the drinking wasn't for me, but sort of in the in the environment that I was with, and they were good people too. I don't want to just, you know, my environment, that was the problem. You know, I'm still in touch with people today. 00:08:53.46 nextlevelguypodcast No. Yeah. 00:08:55.06 Tom Jenkins But yeah, it was... I don't know. i never liked school. I never liked being sort of kept in in a box, sit your desk for eight hours. 00:09:07.13 Tom Jenkins um I've always enjoyed being outside moving. Fortunately, I've always, you know, my parents are sportsmen. I've always been into sport, you know, and even in my worst times, that sort of kept me up. At least I kept moving and doing one positive thing, but. Yeah, I think a lot of a lot of young people back then and now are using drinking to cover over their lack of self-confidence, their lack of direction. They're using their phones now, as ah you know, as he touched on, staying in, you know, and just not socializing and not building those connections. 00:09:44.70 Tom Jenkins In terms of the careers, you know, i think the best thing somebody can do is provide you know work and provide for their family, you know, and a lot of people don't have you know, the fortune, you know, to be able to, oh, I'm going to go work in my dream job or being in my dream area. And it's, you know, there are so many different reasons that play into this. But I think, I think a lot of people who do have the fortune to do something different, you know, they know they don't want to drink, gamble, drugs, stay in the work they're in, stay in the bad relationship, have the sexual problems. And mean that's a big reason I wrote this book. 00:10:22.36 Tom Jenkins It was sort of for me, ah wish I wish I'd read this for myself when I was an 18 year old. You know, I'd have known I'm not alone and there are different options and you can get through this. 00:10:34.14 Tom Jenkins But I've also written this for any other 18 year olds, you know, or 50 year olds, whatever, that, you know, that are going through the same thing that are maybe making bad decisions, lost or just looking for something else. 00:10:47.89 nextlevelguypodcast Because when read like some of these like self-help, and I've bought hundreds of these things. you know and It's always, do this. This will change your life. I did this. And I became super successful. you know And I love how you're in your book, you actually just go, I did this. I fucked up. I made this mistake. I hurt myself. I did this. I broke up with it. You are completely honest. And you're not sugarcoating anything about it. 00:11:13.66 nextlevelguypodcast What was it that you, but because I do a lot of self-sabotage. I do a lot of like jealousy. I struggle with intrusive thoughts. There's all sorts of things that are sort of I know that hold me back, not feeling worthy. And I think this is part of the reason for starting the podcast. What did you think other people had that you didn't have? Was there something you felt was missing? 00:11:36.70 Tom Jenkins It was, you know, it was I think a lot of people as well, if they're brutally honest, were struggling with, who at least those around me, were struggling with a lot of the same things I was. 00:11:48.67 Tom Jenkins But what was missing is, I guess, you know, we've touched on self-confidence, but that's easy to easy to go on. You know, a lot of people do. Maybe a role model or somebody to look up to who is like doing something different and going down a different path to sort of the professional services, nine to five job, which, you know, at the time, you know back in my you know, back in the early 2000s was still linked to that culture of, well, on a Friday, you go to the pub and then, you know, on a Saturday night, 00:12:16.86 nextlevelguypodcast none 00:12:20.85 Tom Jenkins were out as well. You know you can throw some drugs in there. We haven't touched on that too. And you know that sort very much was the culture. And I think I was you know maybe missing sort of a role model who was doing something different in a different way. 00:12:36.50 Tom Jenkins But that said, you know even with that, at the stage I was feeling myself, you know, I didn't have it within me to, there were plenty of role models and I just didn't have it within me to go out and search for that. So it was, I think what was missing was getting to an ultimate low to actually realize, you know, it was a night after drinking drugs. As I say, I was functional and I could earn some money. Sometimes I could hold myself together for six months or so. 00:13:04.98 Tom Jenkins And i've I've traveled, you know, so I got away with Brazil for two weeks with a friend of mine and had a story of trying cocaine for the first time there. Ended up back in a hostel room, throwing a load of stuff around, sort of like a messed up rock star with none of the glamour and all of the shame. 00:13:24.66 Tom Jenkins Pissed a load of people off. Left the hostel the next morning, having not paid our bill for six days. And, you know, this was after two weeks of similar behavior with drinking beforehand and just on a flight back to London being like, you know, in the next few days after I cannot continue like this, you know, this was 2021. 00:13:48.16 Tom Jenkins um' stealing drugs, drinking, throwing other people's stuff around the hostel room, you know, and just getting to that point of my life has to change and I have to do something different. And I made a lot of mistakes, a lot of slip ups past that, you know, and I still do, you know, that's what I try and get across. I'm um no guru. I'm no nobody to tell anyone what to do. 00:14:11.22 Tom Jenkins We all have our own paths, but maybe, you know, if somebody can relate to my story, They learn something from it and you know that's kind of the idea. 00:14:20.66 nextlevelguypodcast No, I really liked the book because initially you're kind of reading it and you're kind of like, oh, you know, you can see and you're kind of like, Jesus, I wasn't so bad. But like you said, it's great to see that other people have the feelings of not being enough, the feelings of them not fitting in. You know, and I can remember being like drinking myself to kind of fit in or always feeling like being the joker to try to not know my place. So I crack jokes to try to make people like me. 00:14:50.04 nextlevelguypodcast did you Were you telling yourself these sorts of things? Were you always having a justification in your head about why you'd smashed up the hotel room or why you had gone and tried cocaine? 00:15:00.47 nextlevelguypodcast or Was there always something that justified it in your head? 00:15:06.44 Tom Jenkins No, I mean, it was part of, well, it's just what we do and it's just, you know, how, how we enjoy ourselves. There's part of that. 00:15:15.06 nextlevelguypodcast what you do the weekend. 00:15:15.23 Tom Jenkins There's part of, well, it's, yeah, yeah. 00:15:15.98 nextlevelguypodcast One of the boys kind thing. Yeah. 00:15:19.09 Tom Jenkins It's part of, well, it's, well, it's my escape, but you know, no, ultimately deep down, I knew I knew all the time, this isn't where I want to be and I have to change, but yeah, I had to, 00:15:32.28 Tom Jenkins I had to really get to that low to to then go about turning things around. 00:15:37.50 nextlevelguypodcast Do you think that's why you didn't take that so long was that the pain points were always a bit of a sore head or a bit of shame? There was never anything truly bad up to that point? 00:15:50.87 Tom Jenkins No, I mean, you know, like I think because the emotional side, the emotional side of a hangover or losing a load of money on like Lithuanian basketball or, you know, whatever I'm betting on, you know, always feels worse than the physical side. 00:16:06.55 Tom Jenkins um So I think, no, i knew I was struggling and I knew I wasn't happy with where I was going and I knew i was very down and, 00:16:18.71 Tom Jenkins anxious, you know, was never, i was never to the point, you know, I know, but you know, a lot of people have feel a lot worse, you know, get to self harm of suicidal levels. 00:16:20.78 nextlevelguypodcast Hmm. 00:16:28.75 Tom Jenkins I was never there. I know was never anywhere near having those thoughts, you know. but I knew, you know, i really wasn't feeling good with myself. And I knew as much as I tried to justify it or laugh it off, I knew, i knew I didn't want to be here. 00:16:46.14 nextlevelguypodcast Did you ever kind of consider it as punishment more than pleasure? You know, that you were actually trying to keep have like a justification of why you weren't where you wanted to be? You know, that you could say, well, it's because i I like a drink or, you know, it's because of my drinking that I can't be this type of person that I want to be. you know, were you trying to find a reason to hold yourself back? 00:17:09.05 Tom Jenkins I don't think so. I just think I just got so lost in it. And it was just the easy way out. And it was the escape. And I didn't know what else to do. And I didn't know how else to be. 00:17:20.76 Tom Jenkins i didn't know how to be around people. I didn't know. I didn't know how to be with girls, you know, touch on the sexual experiences. You know, i lost my virginity at 22, 23. 00:17:32.30 Tom Jenkins And you know, all the cool kids and inverted commas or whatever were, you know, dating at 14, 15. And I just had no confidence to connect. 00:17:40.29 nextlevelguypodcast Hmm. 00:17:42.61 Tom Jenkins Even if I did, um you know, who would want to be with me at a party? know, I'd just be like the drunk idiot. Like, you'd want to run away from me. Um, you know, so when it finally came to that, I had as little confidence and connection in in the sexual side as I did every other area of my life. And, you know, it was just an utter disaster. I just write about it in the book, got back to hers, nothing worked, had to just come clean. She was 33. I was 22, 23. I always forget ages. 00:18:14.33 Tom Jenkins Um, and I just had to be, look, I have no idea what I'm doing. And yeah, i write this, um, I left the room. I did manage to get the condom on. Anyway, I needed to piss. 00:18:23.64 nextlevelguypodcast It's an achievement. 00:18:23.89 Tom Jenkins Went down the slight street, started to piss and wondered why no urine was coming out and realized I still had the condom on. So it was just filling up with urine. So that was like, fortunately, nobody else was was around to see that. 00:18:37.29 Tom Jenkins But for myself, just looking at myself in that moment, moment that was just an ultimate like, oh shit, we're not we're not good at the sexual side either, even though already knew that. 00:18:49.08 nextlevelguypodcast Because that's the good thing about the book is so you even though sometimes we we laugh or we feel sad for you or you, you sometimes stop and go, well, I don't know that myself or I don't know about that part. 00:18:55.23 Tom Jenkins Thank 00:19:00.77 nextlevelguypodcast So you start sort of making the reader want to improve themselves or learn about the stuff or they can kind of relate to you in the book. And I like that part about it. It's like I could see a lot of my younger self, that the the self-hatred, the depression, the inability to fit in side. And i was kind of let it made me go, oh, I can really relate to this guy. What was your opinion about being a guy back then? Because nowadays we have this toxic masculinity bullshit. We're under-tating that. 00:19:36.85 nextlevelguypodcast What do you think it meant to be a man and to to be? Because you know we don't have the role models showing us how to do it. what What was it being a man to you at that point? 00:19:47.00 Tom Jenkins I mean, I didn't even, it wasn't really a conversation back then, you know, now it's, you know, it's, yeah, the big thing of what is masculinity, what's toxic, the Manosphere documentary and all of that. 00:19:58.83 Tom Jenkins But I think, you know, this was happening in the early 2000s. You know, for me, probably, yeah, 2005 to like those seven years 00:20:02.81 nextlevelguypodcast We just got on with it, didn't we? but 00:20:11.09 Tom Jenkins one were my bad times and Yeah, there was just no conversation, you know, a mental health. It wasn't, it wasn't a big, you know, now I think sometimes we actually go too far and there's just like people, you know, crying on Instagram for just for views and attention. 00:20:31.54 Tom Jenkins Now I don't want to knock it, you know, so much incredible progress and in the mental health space and may it always continue, but it's almost... You know, we've gone full circle in a lot of senses. 00:20:43.34 Tom Jenkins um But back then, yeah, I mean, nobody had a conversation, you know, about mental health. We'd laugh about it. We'd be like, oh, we're fucking messed up, aren't we? 00:20:54.19 Tom Jenkins Like, and that that was about it. 00:20:56.31 nextlevelguypodcast ah 00:20:57.41 Tom Jenkins So, yeah. 00:20:59.42 nextlevelguypodcast yeah you would say like one of your guys you'd be like oh he's just one of the lads or he's he's a character you know i think that was how we accepted it i mean the like the intimacy issues you you mentioned the books which you a hundred you're so vulnerable about and it's amazing to read it that you can be so open about it and it'll inspire somebody else who's struggling to you know go see a doctor see like a nurse for advice etc um or like to learn about these things because i think like sex education it's just like 00:20:59.67 Tom Jenkins I don't know. Yeah. 00:21:07.99 Tom Jenkins Yeah. 00:21:29.69 nextlevelguypodcast Like what, you know, what's an erection? That's how babies are made. Right. Done. You know, we don't get that side of thing. How did, how did that come out of you at the time? 00:21:36.09 Tom Jenkins I mean, 00:21:38.86 nextlevelguypodcast Because did you struggle like to that that feelings? Cause you couldn't go and say it to a mate. How did you, how did that behavior kind of spiral out of you? 00:21:49.43 nextlevelguypodcast Like at work with friends? Did you notice your aggression, anger? Was there any kind of negative side effects because you couldn't talk about this stuff? 00:22:00.41 Tom Jenkins Yeah, I mean, it wasn't, so I hid. I mean, that was always my way of dealing. I wasn't, you know, even in my worst like drunk times, i was never, i was never aggressive. I was never violent. I was just, I was sort of the stupid joker, the stupid idiot, the clown, the clown's the right word. And, you know, I'd hide behind that personality. 00:22:23.18 Tom Jenkins i'd hide behind the drinking behind it. I'd laugh it off the next day. um And yeah, you know, and so so as I say, of work, ah course sure I had two personalities, you know, when my first job was working in in sales, um and it was like it was a great job. 00:22:41.83 Tom Jenkins And, you know, was sort of the a professional guy, and I could go out and present, and I could look people in the eyes for doing that, you know, and it was funny, I could connect sort of on a non-personal level. 00:22:48.54 nextlevelguypodcast Mm-hmm. 00:22:54.10 Tom Jenkins But when it became to personal, intimate levels, I just couldn't do it. And You know, at work at the time, people had no idea what I was doing on the weekend or what I'd done before. 00:23:06.59 Tom Jenkins You know, so I said turned up to the second interview after after ah being at the American sports bar in London playing beer pong. I turned up hungover and I still got the job because I could, it wasn't all negative. You know, I was functional. Maybe that didn't help me at all because I could i could cover things. I could put a lid on things and sort of try and lie and hide. And, you know, certainly to my parents, spin and manipulate things. You know, obviously by the time I was working, I'd moved out. But in the sort of 15, 16, 17, when you know, when you're going down the parks, 00:23:44.50 Tom Jenkins stealing a bottle of vodka from their cupboard or whatever else, you know, well then I'm just lying and lying and manipulating to, to, to cover over that. 00:23:48.55 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 00:23:55.26 nextlevelguypodcast And was there a point where you kind of had like enough of success that you ever felt like yourself during these like really dark times? Was there a bit where you kind of felt, oh, that's me or something kind of like a hobby or an interest kind of spiral? Because there's a lot of negativity in the book. Like, you know, this bad event, this happened. mean, you have some amazing titles like, and you know, the... 00:24:20.50 nextlevelguypodcast teaching at a school and the kid's calling you posh can or saying that your refugee camps are like Tinder for you. You know, there's all these amazing bits of the book that I could, I had to reread because was laughing so much. 00:24:32.44 nextlevelguypodcast But a lot of it, I was kind of going, I like this guy because you're so, you're so likable. No matter, throughout the book, you're just like, have to meet this guy. He's awesome. 00:24:43.10 nextlevelguypodcast But what was it? 00:24:43.51 Tom Jenkins but 00:24:43.94 nextlevelguypodcast Was there a moment that you felt like yourself back then? Or were you always kind of chasing these highs? 00:24:50.20 Tom Jenkins I mean, I think like anyone, you know, we all want to make a difference. And, you know, when I was trying to do good things, you know, as say, was volunteering in a school where, you know, people have been, at so one of the kids have been expelled for trying to burn their last school down. 00:25:04.26 Tom Jenkins So it was sort of like a ah school for troubled kids. And, you know, i felt good trying to help. 00:25:09.21 nextlevelguypodcast ya 00:25:11.14 Tom Jenkins But then at the same time, I referenced in a book, well, what's a kid who's come up from in a background that I could never imagine? How is he going to relate to me who's just grown up? 00:25:22.26 Tom Jenkins in a completely different way. So that's how I got the Nickman posh cunt in that school. And, you know, fair enough. um You know, I didn't achieve anything helping at that school. But, you know, when you're trying to do good, it always feels good. And, you know, as I say, was lucky with the sport and keeping a bit active. 00:25:40.57 Tom Jenkins Even in my worst times, i was still, you know, I was still playing some football, still still doing different things, running and and this and that. So that kept me going. And, 00:25:51.99 Tom Jenkins You know, i had good people around as well. It wasn't all bad, you know, no role models. I want to be him. But, and, you know, as I say, slowly, little by little, where you get to the point where you have to turn it round. And, you know, the first half of the book or third of the books, like the real negative, then there's sort of the middle third where it's sort of trying to find different paths. And I keep going wrong, but at least I'm doing my best to try something different. 00:26:19.13 Tom Jenkins And then there's the final third, where, you know, sort of things things do begin to click into pack place in a very positive way. So I'm sure we'll come on to a bit of that in a bit later on. 00:26:31.10 nextlevelguypodcast Oh, don't you worry. there's why I was literally like each chapter was giving hundreds of questions. And I was thinking, like how can I put it all into one interview? Because what i did find was like you constantly seem almost self-explode when you got close to success or happiness or seeming to kind of find what you needed. Did calmness ever, like did the comfortable or normality ever become comfortable? 00:27:00.59 nextlevelguypodcast just boring or painful to you? You seem to always want to get away from it. 00:27:04.12 Tom Jenkins Yeah. Yeah, I think that was it as well. I was always running. I was always moving. you know To sort of begin to turn my life around, I ended up back in Brazil, you know where the first big change story happened. which and now you know Now I'm in Colombia, which many people associate you know with Pablo escoort Escobar and cocaine and all of that, you know narcos. 00:27:28.57 Tom Jenkins But really, it's funny, I'll just touch on this, but the amount people I know who've come to Colombia and got completely clean from drinking and drugs is so much more than the other way around. 00:27:39.11 Tom Jenkins Now, you go to the darker tourist parks on a Friday night, you see that site everywhere. It hasn't gone away. 00:27:45.56 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. Mm-hmm. 00:27:46.70 Tom Jenkins You know, if you you look for it, you'll find it. But anyway, coming back to your initial question, yeah, I've always been quite an extreme guy. I've never accepted sort of the status quo, the do this and do that. 00:28:01.14 Tom Jenkins And I think That's a good, that's a very positive thing in itself, but it can also lead to negative things. If you're constantly running and moving from one extreme to the other, you know, whether that's extremes, going from drinking excessive amounts to, you know, then I became a teetotal vegan. um It's this sort of bouncing from one side to the other. Now, I don't i don't really drink at all. i'm happy to have a beer or two every now and then, but that that's as much as I go on my diet. I just try and eat healthy. But, you know, when you're bouncing, even to get away to Brazil and then Colombia and then moving jobs and... 00:28:43.77 Tom Jenkins trying, you know, I sort of joined, I say, joined a cult at one point and got away from that. 00:28:49.78 nextlevelguypodcast I was going to touch on that. 00:28:51.77 Tom Jenkins um 00:28:52.06 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:28:54.14 Tom Jenkins The first girl I really thought I loved, I met her, you know, trying to help at a refugee camp um in in the jungle in Calais. It was called The Jungle at the time. She was a volunteer as well, I should add. She wasn't ah a refugee. She was ah a British volunteer. But, you know, i came, i thought, this is the one and we're going to be together forever. And I love her and all of this, even though i hardly even knew her. 00:29:19.93 Tom Jenkins But like cut touching back to your initial question, I found what I thought I wanted and I couldn't be with it because I didn't have the confidence that to believe that she could also love me. 00:29:31.61 Tom Jenkins and I'm not sure it was even love. It was more attachment at the time because I didn't know what love was. 00:29:36.10 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 00:29:38.17 Tom Jenkins And then, yeah, I just hit the self-destruct button. then You know, i was just losing it inside because I knew I couldn't sustain being with a girl this good. And I wasn't that good. 00:29:50.90 Tom Jenkins That's how I felt. You know, obviously, I know that's not true now. but And yeah, you know, I just managed to to make the whole thing fall apart. And Yeah, you know, after for that, turned back to drinking and drugs a little bit, kept my head above water. I knew I didn't want to go back there, but ended up, ah you know, ended up in sort of some personal self-development. i don't know if I can call it a cult, you know, because there were some good things to it. But I just got very involved trying to volunteer and recruit other people to come and be part of this 00:30:28.06 Tom Jenkins organization as well. don't want to mention the name. co I mean do mention it in the book. You'll be able to find it there, but just to not not get myself in any legal issues. 00:30:33.45 nextlevelguypodcast that 00:30:38.30 Tom Jenkins But um yeah, and it took me a long time struggling to get over this girl. I turned to this cult. before i finally moved away and got back to columb South America again and Columbia again, where I managed to get my head down, find a good job and begin to sort my life out again. that There were many problems still and underneath that. 00:31:04.60 nextlevelguypodcast I mean, you do do amazing stuff. You know, you do a lot of volunteer work, that you're raising money for charities, then, you know, you're in a cult, then you're doing CrossFit, then you're drinking, you know, you go into your gambling and you... 00:31:19.64 nextlevelguypodcast talk about getting assaulted and then trying cocaine and like a mate and then going into Brazilian and like shanty towns and all these kind of, you know, people go, bloody hell. You traveled the world doing amazing things. 00:31:33.02 nextlevelguypodcast Did you ever give yourself credit at the time for your resilience, for your ability to try new things, to never let these things completely destroy you, that you're always pushing yourself forward? Because that alone is a serious skill that a lot of people don't have. 00:31:48.84 Tom Jenkins I give myself the credit now and I always tell people I never let my flame burn out. I see other people around me who have sort of, you know, still following many of the same patterns and things. And I'd love to help. 00:32:02.04 Tom Jenkins But, you know, it seems they're a bit stuck in where they're going. But even in my worst times, as I say, I always dreamed them more and I always felt even when Even when I'm you know on a cocaine hangover, after stealing for a week and feeling worse than I've ever felt before, and with good reason, I deserve to feel bad in a way. 00:32:23.22 Tom Jenkins you know you have to sometimes feel that pain to make that change. And even then, i knew i was going to find more. 00:32:27.59 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:32:31.22 Tom Jenkins And that's kind of where I kept going on and kept going to these new things and these new extremes, because I knew i was going to find, in quotes, what I was looking for. 00:32:42.18 Tom Jenkins I mean, and at the end of the day, I think all we're looking for is just to sit down at the end of the day and be at comfortable and be at peace with ourselves. I think, you know, a lot of the Mamasphere documentary sells it where you have to drive the Bugatti and have five different girls around your arm and this is everyone's dream. 00:33:00.46 nextlevelguypodcast But 00:33:01.19 Tom Jenkins You know, and I think most you know most people know that's bullshit. You know, i think most of us, what we're looking for is, of course, a roof over our heads. stable me a meal, purpose in our day. 00:33:13.98 Tom Jenkins And just to sit down at the end of the day and just feel comfortable and good in our own skin, whilst knowing that we're all going to have highs and lows and that's sort of the natural flow of life. But know that you're good and you can deal with whatever comes your way. 00:33:29.37 nextlevelguypodcast I suppose that they say if you have to have highs and lows because if it was just in the middle the whole time, ah you'd flatline and be dead. And that's probably very true. I mean, Because you do talk in the book about how you, like a lot of kids, you learn about sex through porn. 00:33:47.10 nextlevelguypodcast You know, that you spent a lot of time watching porn. And I did that a lot myself. And ah because the sex education being so bad and you can't really talk to your dads about these things, we learn through, like, some really dodgy ways of doing it. You know, you learn through your mate buying you your first beer when you're underage. You learn through sex through porn, et cetera. 00:34:09.84 nextlevelguypodcast what did you find mixing loneliness, feelings of in inadequacy with porn? How did that affect you and your sexual drive? 00:34:19.50 Tom Jenkins I had no idea at the time how it was affecting me. I think just everyone watched porn. um You know, I don't think we'd even talked about it that much, but you kind of knew everyone was doing, maybe not everyone, but you know, 95% of people were doing the same thing. 00:34:35.72 nextlevelguypodcast Okay. 00:34:36.57 Tom Jenkins um And I didn't even know it was bad. I didn't know it would be affecting how I viewed sex, how I viewed females. You know, there's so many studies linking porn to erectile dysfunction these days. 00:34:49.72 Tom Jenkins Something, you know, as the title of the book touches on, I covered over with Cialis, a product like Viagra for a long time until, you know, i 00:34:53.05 nextlevelguypodcast Perfect. 00:34:59.70 Tom Jenkins eventually got to the real root of the problem and everything else and healed it naturally. But yeah, I i didn't even know. But I think like anything, when you're sat on your own, staring at a screen, and I think we've all been through this, the porn you start with, well, when you first see it, it's something probably quite normal in Iniston. But then, you know, it gets... 00:35:21.56 Tom Jenkins Well, that gets boring. So, you know, then you're watching porn with three, four, five people and it's just like, this isn't life. This isn't connection. This isn't good. And the dopamine hit, you know, it works in the same way to the drinking and the cocaine. chasing short-term pleasure and pushing away long-term connection and actually finding you know a real partner or somebody you want to spend your life with or you know at least forming some real relationships with the opposite sex or the same sex you know um and yeah it's just a shame that that's how so many of us were spending our you know spending our time back then 00:36:05.14 Tom Jenkins behind a screen watching porn. 00:36:08.02 nextlevelguypodcast Do you think that's still a case now where men kind of, that we really equate, you know, like connection through by stimulation, you know, we because we can do that, we can chat to friends on screens and stuff like that. We don't actually need to be there and speak to people or be physical with somebody or actually have a connection. We can just go on and watch two strangers, you know doing this or doing that, or we can order food to our house. We don't need to have connection anymore. 00:36:37.99 Tom Jenkins Yeah, it's worrying. You know, you just need to look, just walk down the road and look at people in a restaurant these days. If there's a table of four, the chance that all four of them are on their phone, WhatsAppping somebody else is pretty high, you know, and it's that phone. 00:36:53.26 nextlevelguypodcast um 00:36:54.61 Tom Jenkins I think, you know, porn addiction is is one of the biggest plagues playing in society that we don't talk about. i think social media addiction and phone screen time is talked about a lot more, more and more these days. And it has to be because if we sat at a table with somebody and we're just staring at our phone screen instead of actually connecting with them, that's what worries me with today's day and age. And, you know, you throw in AI and virtual reality and maybe we're going to have these goggles and, you know, everyone's hooked up to the meta or whatever. 00:37:30.55 Tom Jenkins um It's... It's worrying, but I think a lot of people are clocked on to this and they're clocked on and that they are turning their back. Well, still, you know, it's incredible. 00:37:41.82 Tom Jenkins Here we are. I'm in Colombia. I don't actually know where you are, but we're we're doing this podcast and how how amazing that we expect to so many people. 00:37:48.27 nextlevelguypodcast in Glasgow? 00:37:51.06 Tom Jenkins It's not to knock it all on the head as the devil, but like anything in their life, the the medicine, the benefits are in in the use, the healthy use or the unhealthy use. 00:37:51.74 nextlevelguypodcast Hmm. 00:38:03.70 nextlevelguypodcast I mean, if there is somebody going through that, you know, who, because you you do mention, you know, that you had used prostitutes and stuff. And that was the thing that the first thing that you'd actually said in the book where you seem to be genuinely kind of ashamed or upset about, you know, you didn't really want to mention it. 00:38:22.74 nextlevelguypodcast How did that serve sexual shame? Because I found it interesting that you could do stand-up comedy and you could go out and perform that way, but you didn't give yourself credit for attempting to perform in other ways. 00:38:35.35 nextlevelguypodcast And I found that sort of, almost that balance between the two was quite interesting, how you never saw performing in front of people and connecting with people in that way, but you struggled, you put so much pressure on yourself to connect in the bedroom. 00:38:37.68 Tom Jenkins Yeah. 00:38:51.83 nextlevelguypodcast Was it ever, did you ever kind of consider that? 00:38:52.34 Tom Jenkins yeah 00:38:55.32 Tom Jenkins Yeah, it's this funny. Now looking back, you know, I could connect with people, I could public speak, which is the opposite to most people's fears, you know, they have it the other way around. But I think because I struggle to connect on an intimate level, you know, when you're speaking to 100 people or, you know, doing stand up comedy on stage, it's there's no intimate connection. As soon as things got intimate, as soon as I had to actually touch on, and a lot of my standout comedy was just self-deprecation. So I'd just be knocking myself and I've done so many stupid things and stories that, you know I've got, I've got archives to to touch on. um 00:39:36.50 Tom Jenkins But yeah, when it came to actually really connecting with somebody, that's when it fell apart. And, you know, the prostitution, that was when I was sober as well, because I got sober, I began to sort my life out, but something was still missing. 00:39:52.34 Tom Jenkins And i hadn't, I got rid of the negative, but I hadn't sort of found what I was looking for still. And so I had a gap. And how did I end up filling part of that gap? Well, 00:40:03.64 Tom Jenkins I ended up visiting massage parlours inverted commas. um And I think anyone who's ever done that, and I think it happens a lot more than, you know, obviously people don't talk about it. 00:40:08.25 nextlevelguypodcast a 00:40:15.61 Tom Jenkins And I think it happens a lot more than people would think and believe. You know, when you're walking out the door there, it just feels... you just feel dirty and awful and ashamed. And you know, you know, the girl in there probably doesn't want to be there. 00:40:33.85 Tom Jenkins You know, I'm all for this legal prostitution if it's a free and open and conscious choice. 00:40:38.52 nextlevelguypodcast Hmm. 00:40:40.56 Tom Jenkins But I think for most cases, it's not. And you know that the person probably doesn't want to be there. Maybe they've been forced to be there and you're there contributing to this problem. And that was sort of the duality's of the whole thing I was dealing with, with the prostitution. 00:40:59.22 nextlevelguypodcast I mean, for there are probably a lot of people who are sitting there going, yeah, I do use drug to sort of hold myself, and like be the fun guy when I don't really fit in or feel just like a shell. You know, people are doing drugs because they're too afraid to be alone with their own thoughts. There'll be people who are using but like prostitutes, like you're saying, because they they don't know how to connect to girls or they don't know how to speak to people. 00:41:22.36 nextlevelguypodcast For those who are emotionally starving – What did you find that actually started to chip away at that, give you better connection or a better feeling or just to feel more like yourself? 00:41:36.50 Tom Jenkins I think to begin with, it had to be that decision to that point of no more of this. Now, no more of this doesn't mean that, well, now my life's going to be great. I'm sure there are going to be hundreds of ups and downs as there was for me, you know, even after that decision here, we're talking about prostitution and cults and and this and that, you know, I fell back a million times, but from that point, that decision and that commitment to myself was truly made. You know, i have a friend who says healing is a decision. And it was a decision that I am going to turn this round. 00:42:09.62 Tom Jenkins you know, I think anyone who's drunk's had those nights where he said, I'm not going to do this anymore. But you don't really believe it deep down. When you get to that point of now, no more, that's when things began to look up. 00:42:16.56 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:42:22.55 Tom Jenkins And then the second was i had to find a way, a different environment. um And I ended up back in in South America. I've always loved it here. i've always connected. As much as I have a lot of terrible stories here that I've touched on already, I've connected with really positive sides of the culture as well. And just being in a new environment again where I know nobody, it let me slowly peace my life and build it back together. Now, for anyone listening, you know going to South America is not very feasible for most people, but it can just be those 00:42:57.27 Tom Jenkins well, is this relationship I'm currently in serving me or is it time to change this? Do I need to start looking for a different job? Do I need to find a new place to live? Do I just need to change my diet a little? 00:43:09.38 Tom Jenkins or Start exercising? It's those little things. 00:43:11.29 nextlevelguypodcast Okay. 00:43:11.38 Tom Jenkins It doesn't have to be moving to South America. Those little changes you can make, find your passions. And then for me, you know, as I say, i was struggling. I got rid of a lot of the negative and hadn't found the positive. 00:43:24.73 Tom Jenkins And this is going to be a weird one for a lot of people, but I had heard and the guy was working with had talked very positively about ayahuasca. Now, ayahuasca is a psychedelic ancestral medicine used for thousands of years by indigenous tribes in the Amazon rainforest. 00:43:42.33 Tom Jenkins Now, it sounds like a drug. I associated with it as a drug. always thought it was a drug because of my bad drug experience has stayed away from it but I kept on hearing more and more sort of people having amazing things to say about this and I was feeling really I sort of reached the white picket fence at one point had a girlfriend you know I was still using Cialis to cover over my rectal problems had a good job worked my out to VP of marketing at a big outsourcing company, had a good apartment, was going to CrossFit, keeping myself mostly healthy, but i still felt empty inside. And one day i just thought, fuck it, I'm going to go try that ayahuasca thing. You know, what's the worst that can happen? 00:44:28.44 Tom Jenkins And I ended up all or nothing, as always, at a week-long retreat. That's actually quite common when it comes to these medicines. 00:44:35.07 nextlevelguypodcast Mm-hmm. 00:44:37.00 Tom Jenkins But It's just so hard to describe in words. I used to hate it when I'd ask people, what's ayahuasca like? Oh, it's so hard to describe. And now I've become one of those people, but I do my best. 00:44:50.52 Tom Jenkins It sort of took me, when I drank ayahuasca, it's sort of like a thick tea-like brew. It's sort in a controlled, I won't really want to add this controlled, safe environment with two doctors certified in ancestral medicine. So I'm very much not just preaching, you know, go out and drink some Iowa or take a psychedelic on the street, but it really helped me look at my life and relive some of my childhood memories through the place of a witness, sort of in the Eastern philosophy term. Sort of going back to visions of my past and being able to look and forgive them. 00:45:28.79 Tom Jenkins Seeing abstract different images and how, you know, I could go about rebuilding things in my present and in my future and leaving the past behind. Exactly how this has happened is also almost impossible to get across in a podcast. 00:45:44.63 Tom Jenkins But that experience over those five days is one of the hardest of my life. but it let me just look back through all my past and forgive myself and forgive others around me and start with a new perspective and start knowing that I needed to make some changes still heal the connection and the self-confidence that was still missing inside of me. And I always dreamed of, I'd never really, you say I had a girlfriend, sort had kind of two kind of girlfriends in my past, but It was never anything like real and deep. 00:46:20.88 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:46:20.98 Tom Jenkins And that's what I always wanted. And that's that's that's something that I had to really get to the bottom of myself while I still so struggled so much to be with myself. And when I came out the ayahuasca retreat, the first thing I did was delete all that dating apps on my phone and stop dating and stop trying because I knew I had to get really within myself and be comfortable with myself. And when I found that I knew the girl was who I was meant to be with was going to appear. and 00:46:52.44 Tom Jenkins And that took took nine months of doing that until eventually she did. 00:46:59.70 nextlevelguypodcast Because it's it's a remarkable bit book where you kind of almost cheer when you find your person and, you know, you talk about it beautifully and passionately. 00:47:10.04 nextlevelguypodcast But because mean even when you found Robin Sharma's book, you know, about and the self-help book, you kind of almost made that an addiction of trying to fix it. What was it about the the ceremony, you know, ah taking them the herbal medicine that, you finally broke down those barriers that finally let you be you like what was it what did it show you about yourself or how did it let you make amends with yourself with making forgiving people and that how how does it do that 00:47:41.36 Tom Jenkins Yeah, it's so hard to describe. And there are so many stories of it. And there you know there are some great documentaries you know you'll find on YouTube and met even Netflix these days. 00:47:53.22 Tom Jenkins There's one on Ibogaine for PTSD for veterans. And it's just like, 00:48:00.82 nextlevelguypodcast Because you do say in it that you know you you always ask people and they would all say they don't know and you'd you would hate the answer and you said the exact same thing in the book. 00:48:10.65 Tom Jenkins Yeah. 00:48:12.54 nextlevelguypodcast Is it of such a personal journey? 00:48:12.93 Tom Jenkins it's It is a personal journey, but so many people experience so many of the same things. And I say one of the things I experienced, I say it's firstly being that witness to be able to look back at visions and memories that you'd completely forgotten from from your past experience. 00:48:33.60 Tom Jenkins but being able to just sort of look and observe and forgive them and sort of looking from above as ah in a nonjudgmental way. the other thing was, and this sounds a bit, I was a stone cold atheist my whole life. It was completely illogical to me. 00:48:50.58 Tom Jenkins And in Ayahuasca, and this happens to so many people with psychedelics, I could see a connection that was much bigger than myself. And It was just sort of we're all it's just this greater purpose and this greater being. Now, I'm not talking about a religious sense. Maybe people will relate it to to to their religion. But to me, we could call this God, the universe, energy. 00:49:16.44 Tom Jenkins whatever works for you. It's just this shared greater purpose and this greater faith that we're not just here for ourselves. We're here for something bigger than us and we have to believe in something bigger than us. And finding that faith for me, faith firstly in myself, secondly in humanity, and thirdly in this greater concept, really helped to shift things around and You know, i think faith in humanity these days is a harder one to touch on because we turn on the news and somebody's getting bombed left, right and center every day. 00:49:51.81 nextlevelguypodcast Okay. 00:49:52.20 Tom Jenkins that's not the reality of how, if we're fortunate enough to probably be in the position of everyone listening to this podcast, that we're probably not in a zone of war and destruction. And if, you know, me or you open our eyes tomorrow in the streets, there'll be kids playing, family smiling, dogs running, beautiful nature. And that that is the environment that we're fortunate enough to have around us and to celebrate that humanity. 00:50:20.70 Tom Jenkins Whilst also knowing that a lot of bad things are going on in the world and well how can we contribute to that, however small, just to make the world a better place. And even if that's just picking up a Coke can off the street and putting it in the trash, well, you've done your little thing. And you know some of us think, well, I used to be locked in it. How can I make this change? I need to, I don't know, cure cancer or stop world wars. Well, that's going to take a huge collective effort. And we all just have to do the the best of the little things we have around us first to build something better. 00:50:57.27 nextlevelguypodcast Because there's a bit after like one of the ceremonies where you said how the the ceremony you came, it allowed you to find your voice again, to find, to be you again. 00:51:08.66 nextlevelguypodcast And was that part of the ceremony, that fact that it showed you that you had been taken and that you wanted you to give back, that you wanted to connect, like when you found Darcy, when you decided that you were going to go plant trees, that you were going to go and do these amazing things, you wanted to help other people find themselves? 00:51:28.25 nextlevelguypodcast did that Was that part of it, finding your voice, making you realize your purpose? 00:51:34.19 Tom Jenkins 50% realizing my purpose and realizing that there wasn't this huge mecca I had to arrive to where was going to be healing everything. But just start, you know, there's that famous saying, I forget who says it, if you want to heal the world, start by healing yourself. 00:51:49.62 Tom Jenkins So that became my purpose and making those little changes to help make the world around me a better place. And yeah, give rather than take. And then the second side to were finding in my voice was all the times I wanted to say, no, I don't want to go down this route. You know, when I was being a clown in the pub and they're saying, I'll go on Tom, like have another drink or whatever. 00:52:12.54 Tom Jenkins And when I wanted to just say, no, I don't want this because I didn't know what else to do. I'd just take it or do whatever stupid thing I didn't want to do. There was 50% of just finding that voice to say right? 00:52:26.55 Tom Jenkins I think a lot of people struggle to say no. And, you know, i still do at times, you know, still working on that. there's It's that confidence piece, 50 percent and that purpose piece, 50 percent. 00:52:39.61 nextlevelguypodcast what was it about was it you deciding that you were worthy enough or did how do you think that you of 00:52:51.39 nextlevelguypodcast I don't want to say work toward, but you know you actually... materialized almost Darcy into your life. You know, you said earlier about how you kind of, you knew you just, it was no longer, I'm going to swipe. I know she's going to come. She'll find me when she has never or needed. 00:53:09.46 nextlevelguypodcast What was it about it? And what advice would you give to very single people like myself to find that person? Because you talk about her so beautifully in the book and so positively and how she's made such an impact on you and the great things you're doing together. 00:53:23.48 nextlevelguypodcast But for people who haven't found their own version, what what advice would you give them not to sell, but to find the person, their person? 00:53:33.90 Tom Jenkins I'd say that faith that I touched on comes into it massively. Just trust in yourself and in the world around you, that when you become the person you want to be or you know you truly are, you will attract people. 00:53:47.35 Tom Jenkins The other person, you know, the other half, who's meant for you? Now, that sounds a bit buzzwordy. So to go more into into detail, you know, what did I have to do? Well, in my journey, I first had to stop drinking, gambling and drugs. 00:54:03.80 Tom Jenkins I mean, without that, would have never done it. Well, now I'm getting a bit lost and I'm going sideways, maybe into cults or I've gone to prostitution. That's probably the worst thing you can do to find ah another partner. But begin to recognize, you know, the patterns and the things you're doing inside you. that are harming them. And then what can you do to get to the root cause of that lack of self-confidence or those patterns? Now, for me, ayahuasca helped massively. For other people, it may be yoga, meditation, walking in a park. You know, we all have our own different ways, but... 00:54:40.25 Tom Jenkins if you're able to sit with yourself and be with yourself and be present to the surrounding, to your environment around, you know, sort of going into more the Eastern and Buddhist side of things. 00:54:51.22 Tom Jenkins I mean, meditation can play a huge role in that. And then finding your passions, you know, i got away from that, you know, I have no time for my passions because I was drinking and whatever else and I'd have no energy or spent all my money gambling but you know if your passion's yoga well you know, but better take more time to that and give yourself time and give yourself a break. for forgive Forgiveness as well, you know, forgiving. And we always think of forgiveness as I forgive you, the other person, but the most important form of forgiveness comes back to ourselves. And we're all going to make mistakes. I make hundreds of mistakes still, you know, i try and get that across in the book. You know, why would you listen to me? Look at all the things I've done in my past. But, You know, we're going to fall down and we're going to make mistakes. And maybe we're going to enter the wrong relationship again. and oh how have I ended up here again? 00:55:49.50 Tom Jenkins but just, okay, well, what's there to learn from this? 00:55:52.39 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 00:55:52.50 Tom Jenkins What's there to accept from this? And stand back up and thank the lessons. Forgive the bad. Look forward to the good and have faith that you're moving in the right direction if you're making the decisions that you know are true to yourself and your heart. 00:56:08.75 nextlevelguypodcast I love that. That's a cracking answer because, you know, like when when you're reading the book, you're just like, we want you to succeed. We want you to do well. you know we're We cheer when you succeed. We cheer when you when you finally get happy and that you can see this transformation. 00:56:26.33 nextlevelguypodcast i mean, something I really struggle with is regret. When now that you're happy and you're looking back and, you know, writing the book and it's a cathartic, like transformative thing and you're kind of making peace with it etc did you struggle with a regret and think oh that was years wasted because you do mention how those incidents made you who you are so to change them would have changed you do you ever regret any of it is there any parts of it you really struggle with 00:56:57.74 Tom Jenkins I mean, I think it's it's just natural that we look back and have that regret sometimes. And and I still do. But deep down, I know it all had to happen how it happened to learn the lessons that I had. Now, some of the things that I did that hurt other people, you know, it's easy to say, I'd love to go back and change it, but I can't. 00:57:20.57 Tom Jenkins And I had to live that path and do those things and go through that journey. to get to where I am now. Now, I don't think it's necessary to do that. I think plenty of people learn without going to such extremes, but, you know, that was that was my life and that's what I did. So it's been done now and what what good can it do going back there and thinking, well, why did I do that? 00:57:45.37 Tom Jenkins Let, let, forgive, learn a lesson and the move forward with faith knowing that I'm in a stronger place today. 00:57:51.99 nextlevelguypodcast I mean a big part I liked about the book was where you openly admitted that where you fucked up again or you made a similar mistake or you slipped back or i love where you kind of said you know I go like round in a circle then I go off to the square then I'm up in this corner and you know you you're openly about that you did make mistakes and you tried you go too far one end or you would kind of become addictive to try fix yourself or help yourself and then you'd slip back. You know, what its it's the honesty in the book. It's such a sell button. it's Your story is amazing, but... 00:58:27.29 nextlevelguypodcast we can see yourself in you. But for those people who are thinking, yeah, but I would like to do that, but I always slip back. What did you find out about making, you know, getting back on the horse after you've fallen off, after you've made a mistake? Was it anything that you found was good to not dwell on it, but to learn from it and get back and carry on? 00:58:51.32 Tom Jenkins For me, exercise has always been a center that I've had, you know, and just getting outside and just going for a walk. I've always been, i grew up in the countryside and just being with nature and and getting some exercise in was always something. But I think the longer I went on, 00:59:13.31 Tom Jenkins Falling back doesn't have to be a reason to go back to square one and where you are before. You know, we all thought, you know, used classic, the baby example, learning to walk. 00:59:24.76 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 00:59:24.87 Tom Jenkins Well, to begin with, they fall down a thousand times. And then by the end, it's just every now and then. And then, you know, they're walking fine. And... It's just that. You don't have to go back to square one. Okay, I've fucked up again. I've done it again. This hurts. This is painful. But be with it. Because I think as well, we also try and run from the hurt. 00:59:47.67 Tom Jenkins Cover it over. I drink. I'll get in. ah My relationship's just ended. I'll get on the rebound. I'll get in another relationship. Oh, shit. I don't like this job. Well, let's just jump to another job. I don't like that. We're out truly sitting down. 01:00:03.52 Tom Jenkins breathing and accepting where we are and feeling the hurt, processing it. You know, there's the the Buddhist phrase, pain is inevitable. Suffering is a choice. 01:00:14.90 Tom Jenkins And it's important sometimes to feel that hurt, but we don't have to stay there for two years, five years, going over the suffering again and again and again. 01:00:27.67 nextlevelguypodcast Do know, like the the person that you read in the book at the start is certainly not the person who would have that level of depth that you have now. And it's amazing to see this kind of depth, this growth that you have, the understanding. And I think that's why your book will help a lot of people is, 01:00:46.90 nextlevelguypodcast You know, that you do admit you made a lot of mistakes that, you know, you're maybe going through these things now. This is how I did it. But this is how I came out of it You and you give a lot of tips in the book about how people can find it themselves. 01:00:59.90 nextlevelguypodcast But when you do look into this now and you think back that you did this, you were fighting and but getting beaten up in nightclubs or you were getting robbed or found in alleyways drunk and that, does ah normal life ever feel flat? does it Do you miss the excitement 01:01:20.34 Tom Jenkins I mean, I just, don't get me wrong, Cosanta talks about like the the place in Medellin near I'm based where on a Friday night, you'll find the drinking and the drugs is called Poblado. 01:01:32.70 Tom Jenkins And know it also has all the best restaurants. 01:01:32.93 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 01:01:35.42 Tom Jenkins So, and I do enjoy, who doesn't enjoy great food. So go down with my wife sometimes and I'm not sure, you know, maybe there on a Friday night, I'm not sure it ever goes away like, 01:01:47.16 Tom Jenkins when I leave at nine o'clock, oh, be fun just to go and get completely fucked up tonight. It's so easy. It's right there in front of me. 01:01:54.97 nextlevelguypodcast yeah 01:01:55.38 Tom Jenkins But I just know, like I know where it ends up and I know where I am now. And I have like a higher vision and a higher purpose to throw out a couple of buzzwords, you know? I'm so happy like with my wife now, you know, there's nobody on this planet I could love more. 01:02:13.93 Tom Jenkins have a natural reserve where we're planting thousands of trees, working still part-time in sort of a sales consultancy role that is flexible and pays me well. 01:02:24.67 Tom Jenkins And, you know, I've just built where I'm filming this from. We've just finished building a country house, beautiful and natural wood and growing all our own food down here now. 01:02:32.38 nextlevelguypodcast Awesome. 01:02:34.34 Tom Jenkins So it's, It's been all a struggle I had to go through to get to where I am now. And you know if if if you're struggling, 01:02:45.94 Tom Jenkins If you're struggling, you know, so was I and so many others and and you're not alone. And there are so many groups and communities and books and resources and techniques and tools. 01:02:57.75 Tom Jenkins You know, we've talked about a lot on this podcast that you can use to get over it. And, you know, if I can and if anyone else can, so can you. I promise you that. 01:03:09.08 nextlevelguypodcast yeah I mean, it's amazing the transformation. When you read the book to now, you would not imagine this sort of grounded person that you are now, this happy version of yourself. 01:03:19.45 nextlevelguypodcast What was it, do you think, that Darcy saw in you back? you know Because cause you couldn't see it yourself. you know Did like love heal you? Or did you healing yourself and coming to terms with that allow you to find love? 01:03:37.46 Tom Jenkins I think it has to has to come from within one. Finding ah of finding ah another partner, finding somebody else or something outside yourself to cure and heal the love that's missing inside yourself will never work. 01:03:52.62 Tom Jenkins Now, it feels good. It feels nice at times, but it has become it has to come from within within first. And I think, you know, because I always wanted to make a difference. 01:04:02.88 Tom Jenkins And as I say, who who doesn't? We all want to make a difference. But I think By that time, you know, when I was eating better, training better, living better, leaving the negative vices behind, i changed my job, I changed my living environment. 01:04:11.24 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 01:04:17.43 Tom Jenkins um I began, you know, following my passions more, getting outside more. And with the forgiveness that I was feeling every day after the ayahuasca experience and the trust and the faith that i was building, when All that potential that just felt so locked up before began to expand and be released out. 01:04:39.26 Tom Jenkins And I'm sure she felt that in me and I felt that in her and just things locked together. 01:04:42.82 nextlevelguypodcast um 01:04:45.40 Tom Jenkins And look, we still have like any couple in the world, a fair share of fights, problems, insecurities, anxieties. You know, there's always a million more mountains to climb and it's part of it. And I never, you know, make... There's so many mistakes every day still, you know, I never want to preach to anyone. and We're all just here doing the best we can. And, you know, that's all that's all we're trying to do, each and every one of us. 01:05:15.43 nextlevelguypodcast I love it. I love it. i mean, is that why you wanted to create something that, you know, that you were fed up of destroying things or kind of not being part of something that you wanted to give something that would benefit the future generations, you know, potential kids that you wanted to help the the country that given back to you that you, that you want you to just leave a legacy? 01:05:40.50 Tom Jenkins Yeah, i think so. i've always loved I've always loved being outside. I've loved regenerative agriculture, something that I've learned over the last few years. And I've always yet been somebody who's more more outside than inside. So building a natural building or creating a natural reserve and planting trees and learning how to do it from real experts on a huge scale. 01:06:03.99 Tom Jenkins um just, yeah, really excited me. 01:06:03.97 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 01:06:06.55 Tom Jenkins And, you know, from a selfish point of view, it's beautiful to go there and to be part of it and to get to do what I love. But don't think, you know, we should never forget that, you know, it's it's great. 01:06:17.93 Tom Jenkins And then, you know, on the bigger macro level, well, at the same time, it's also giving back to the world and the planet and the environment and creating employment. um That's fantastic too at the same time. 01:06:32.73 nextlevelguypodcast So imagine you have somebody just now who has listened and went, bloody hell, okay, I want that. But I like a drink. I like being one of the lads. you know I do a couple of lines of coke and I get in trouble on that, but I'm not really that i'm not that bad. Or you know but or somebody who finds you know who's maybe hungover they find your book and you know they go, that's a cool title, and they start reading it. 01:06:56.66 nextlevelguypodcast what would you want them to do? How would you want them to use the book or to start changing themselves? Like say they they read it and go, yeah, i want to change. I want to be like this. How do you want them to use the book? 01:07:07.72 Tom Jenkins Yeah, mean, yeah, I think, you know, firstly, you know, people enjoy having a few drinks and they're on a Friday night and doing it in a good way or maybe, you know, gambling every now and then or, you know, just for a bit of fun or very, like, normal, manageable levels. 01:07:26.94 Tom Jenkins Great. Like, you know, i don't want to demonize anything. There's a lot of positives that come from that. I'd say it's more, you know, speaking to the people who know that what they're doing isn't healthy, and they want to change. 01:07:38.44 nextlevelguypodcast Thank you. 01:07:40.63 Tom Jenkins um You know, that's, that's probably who, it who, who this more speaks to. And if you want to change, and and you relate to what's going on, you know, maybe my book can help you, but there are hundreds of other books out there as well. 01:07:56.15 Tom Jenkins and begin to you know, make a decision, get clear on what you truly want with your life. And, and where you want to go and you know write it down if you need to. Have it present every morning so you don't slip up into the habits that you know you want to get away from. and you know Try and find your passions and your purpose. It doesn't happen immediately. It took me 31 years of fucking everything up. um before I got there and I never stopped searching, you know, being to every extreme there is basically. So don't get impatient as well. i'm 01:08:31.80 Tom Jenkins I am still can be highly impatient, but some things take time and just keep working at it. And, you know, the big changes happen after a thousand little changes. 01:08:46.20 Tom Jenkins So just keep trying to make those little changes every day. And, you know, if you're enjoying your're ah your current life and you're on you're on the right path, keep going forwards, keep going forwards too. 01:08:58.23 nextlevelguypodcast I think you did say that in the book was where you needed to decide you want to change you can't change anybody you know like if somebody is worried about a friend or a brother or mate or whatever what would you say to them you know can you help somebody or do they need to decide themselves 01:09:16.70 Tom Jenkins i mean I think you can influence or you can be in this inspiration or a role model to people. you know It's very difficult to go into somebody's room, you need to change and point the finger there. 01:09:29.02 Tom Jenkins you know And I think sometimes there is a need for that. 01:09:29.49 nextlevelguypodcast Yeah. 01:09:31.94 Tom Jenkins You know you do have to sit somebody down and you know look, what are you doing But unless they're truly open and wanting to do this, it may not get that far. So, you know, it's back to that way. If you want to change the world, first change yourself, be an inspiration, a role model, try and pick pick people up. 01:09:52.09 Tom Jenkins If you have to go and have that friend conversation of, look, what are you doing? You know, it is still worth having in some environments, of course, but ultimately you can't change anyone else. The change has to come first from a within. 01:10:08.73 nextlevelguypodcast And do you find it funny that now that you didn't have a role model growing up, but you're now going to become a role model to help people? And in the sense that your self-improvement style, whereas you're not talking from up here, you know, out in the clouds saying, I'm the guru, this is what you need to do. You're going, hey, I fucked up. You know, i' I'm doing the stupid shit with you, but let's I'll show you how you can get happy again or how you can find yourself. Yeah. 01:10:36.41 nextlevelguypodcast how How do you find now becoming that person that you needed back then? 01:10:42.61 Tom Jenkins I don't know. mean, I'm just, I've never been asked that before. It's a good question. um I'm just comfortable with who I am today, while still having my fair share of anxiety and doubt here or there. 01:10:57.54 Tom Jenkins Because I'm comfortable with who I am. Well, if there's somebody I can help, great. And if there's not, well, what can I do? And I just try and live as live as good as I can and, you know, make a difference where I can. And, you know, i don't really see myself as as a role model or anything else, you know. and But if if people look up to me and learn from me in a positive way, well, I accept that too. So fantastic. 01:11:25.23 nextlevelguypodcast No, because you're definitely going to get a lot of fans reading the book who are going to think, yeah, I like this guy. I want to know more about him. want to find out about him. mean, what's next? Are you planning, you know, you talk in the book about wanting do retreats and taking people and getting them into like the herbal medicines and stuff. But how how can you take this further? What's the kind of like the mission for this? Or is this just to kind of make peace with yourself and put the story out and hope it helps somebody? 01:11:55.96 Tom Jenkins Yeah, a bit of both. You know, yeah, I wrote the book for myself as much for anyone else, but thinking, well, if somebody can relate to my story and learn something from it, fantastic. 01:12:07.54 Tom Jenkins I have no attachments to the book becoming a New York Times bestseller. I'd love it to if it can be fantastic. 01:12:13.52 nextlevelguypodcast No. 01:12:15.38 Tom Jenkins But if only a few people read it and they gain benefit from it too, I'm happy with that too. um so i don't know. I just move forward each day. i said I'd never write another book. And now I have. 01:12:29.88 Tom Jenkins I'm feeling the want to write another book. More a... but more ah sort of a creative book, not based on my life, but sort of more more more fiction, but still following the same themes. 01:12:44.27 Tom Jenkins Anyway, that's ah that that'll be a work in progress for another year or so. but you know but but other than that, you know, just keep, still don't have, we still don't have kids. 01:12:49.14 nextlevelguypodcast Well, we'll get you we'll get you on the show when you get ready to put that out. 01:13:00.24 Tom Jenkins That'll probably happen someday soon. Still can't keep planting trees, still form good relationships around me and just, I don't know, little by little, just try and do the best I can. 01:13:13.08 nextlevelguypodcast And if you think back to that young version of yourself, and now the guy that's sitting here smiling, saying, I love this woman to death. We're um yeah we're talking about having kids. I'm creating this now. 01:13:26.93 nextlevelguypodcast Can you imagine that back then? Because like I'm going through a bit of a period where I don't feel like I fit in. I've got the good job, the good car, all that because and I'm like, yeah, there must be more than this. 01:13:40.06 nextlevelguypodcast it's thought that Is like the Aerosmith song? 01:13:40.15 Tom Jenkins yeah 01:13:42.50 nextlevelguypodcast Is it the journey, not the destination? 01:13:45.34 Tom Jenkins Yeah, I'd say completely that. And, you know, in my worst times, I probably could have never imagined this. But at the same time, there was always that flame here. And, you know, you've got this podcast that snowed out helping a load of people at the same time, too, in exactly the same way to my book. 01:14:05.94 Tom Jenkins who is is in ah in a different way. So just just keep going and doing the best you can and forgiving and smiling and accepting that you you'll continue to fuck up like anyone else and and move forwards when you do. 01:14:22.17 nextlevelguypodcast I mean, I'm ah i'm always guided. I've used up so much your time, but I would love to have you on again and you got because there's so many areas we haven't even touched on and I've used up over an hour of your time. But what would you want people to take from this? you know Until we can do like ah but later on and and do stuff like that, what would you want people to remember about this in terms of the book, your story, potential? 01:14:48.12 nextlevelguypodcast anything and everything, what what would you want them is to take from this as a message? 01:14:53.78 Tom Jenkins I think for people, you know, who are already on their path and going where they want to go, hopefully they just enjoy the read and like my story. And maybe if there's one or two things they can take from it, brilliant. 01:15:06.36 Tom Jenkins But I think, yeah, more for the people who were sort of lost and making the bad decisions that I was back in the day, to be able to look and to realize you're not alone. There is a way out. 01:15:18.65 Tom Jenkins There is a way forward. And it's just about finding your own way and forgiving the bad and accepting things that happen, not trying to be perfect and just move forwards. 01:15:31.01 Tom Jenkins move forwards as best you can and don't lose that flame. Don't lose that light because if you make the decisions you know that true to yourself and your heart, eventually you'll get where yeah where you want to go. 01:15:46.22 nextlevelguypodcast It's a damn good read and it's a damn good learning story and a lot of yeah good things to take. and Before we get to the final question, why should people buy a copy of the book? 01:15:57.24 nextlevelguypodcast Despite that, not not just to help you and make you a number one bestselling author, et cetera. What's the best sales pitch for people to pick up a copy of your book? 01:16:09.34 Tom Jenkins I just think it's a truly honest, brutally honest story that goes to the core of a lot of things that most people wouldn't touch on, and especially the sexual side, because I think there are a lot of incredible books out there on drinking, drugs, and gambling. 01:16:22.29 nextlevelguypodcast Okay. 01:16:26.28 Tom Jenkins And there are also books out there on on the sexual struggles and embarrassment and the shame as well. But just something that tackles all those four together, 01:16:36.98 Tom Jenkins and then goes on to the like slow, painful, mistake-ridden journey to sort of try and turn it round and find a life of meaning. 01:16:47.48 Tom Jenkins um I'd say that's it. i mean i I forget the quote the guy I work with um made about the book. he's yeah he's He's a great mate of mine still. and I'll give you the most transparent book I've ever read about modern struggles with masculinity. 01:17:04.73 Tom Jenkins Tom openly discusses themes that no one else is talking about, but lots of men are going through. And I think for me, that was, Mike, he's an incredible guy. We've known each other 18 years. And for me, that quote really meant something to me. So I'll leave that one. 01:17:23.31 nextlevelguypodcast I'm actually delighted to see the you that was in that book to the you that's now. It's so heartwarming and you I am super proud of the journey and you you should thoroughly pleased and proud of yourself. 01:17:39.19 nextlevelguypodcast And I don't think you you give yourself enough credit. For people who do want to you know get in touch to find out about this and you know do see the work you're doing and just to kind of find their own path and you know like get in touch, et cetera. 01:17:54.90 nextlevelguypodcast How can they keep in touch with this amazing work you're doing? 01:17:58.14 Tom Jenkins Yeah. So if you, um, the book's available on Amazon. So the drunk gambler with a erectile dysfunction, searching for something more, Tom Jenkins. 01:18:08.63 Tom Jenkins And if you want to get in touch with me, my website is the drunk gambler.com. So go there. There's, uh, there's my email or a contact us, contact me form. I forget. Um, Feel free to reach out if if you have any questions, doubts or whatever you want to say, and I'll be delighted to hear from you. 01:18:30.36 nextlevelguypodcast Paul Jayneeson- What.